23 replies to this topic

[Urban Legend]

With Mark Beck winning the 2nd leg of the triple crown in the crossbow class at the I.B.O. shoot, it got me thinking.  Why aren't there more of us shooting these tournaments?  They are great practice and gives us a chance to test our skills, meet other crossbow enthusiasts, and help promote the sport.

[longbow26]

I went with a freind to a bow shoot in Cap Gerado Mo with a barrowed  crossbow 2 years ago, it was a I B O shoot and was told I cant compet with the crossbow. Since it was a compound shoot. I had braught my compound wiht me so no big deal I thouhgt. But I get to teh line and put arrow to string and put mouth tab in mouht to pull string back and im janked off the line. I was told I cant shoot compound that way since it is unsafe to do so.

  granted alot of things have changed towerds the perception of ppls wiht disabilitys and our use of crossbows for hunting and such. I just dint think tehy changed anouf in archery ternaments to take a chance again fo being ridicueld by the ppl runing teh shoot and the participants. Ridicueld simple because I was trying to participate as I was able to.

  I count find any bow leages that would alllow me to use a crossbow at eather. that I could understand. But what I could not understand was not allowing me to finish teh leage out shooting teh comnpound using mouth tab simple becuase a few ppl gripped that my scors were to high shooting one ahnded so i had to be cheating.

  But it shure would be neat to atend a shoot where other crossbow shooters are to shoot along side them and to learn from them.

[buckeye dan]

Not sure how the crossbow events go. I have never attended one. I always assumed they are like pistol events. There is always some guy with sponsorship backing from someone that shows up with a tricked out Kimber with a couple of hundred if not thousand dollars in customization and alterations. You know the sort. Has enough cash and resources to modify top of the line equipment to the point my daughter could rapid fire bulls eyes with proper training.

I used to compete in friendly card shoots for 12 gauge shotguns. Then came the modified, sleeved guns that people spent hundreds of dollars on. Well my old, stock Ivar Johnson was a damn fine gun and could hang with the best of them until the inserts and sleeves started pushing the envelope. You needed to be a fat pocket guy with a lot of time on your hands to hang with those guys. It kind of ruined shooting competition for me. The past time quickly became who had the most money to push the rules to their limit with the best equipment you could afford.

It's one thing to shoot stock weapons. But there is no prestige in that anymore. Now it's all about a sponsor or rich guy passing the time to spend more money than the guy next door to reach the limit of what is acceptable. For example: I figure I can shoot clay pigeons with the best of them. But only when the best of them are using equipment that I can afford. At some point there will always be someone with more cash to out perform you. I wouldn't be afraid to shoot my stock Ruger MK II target pistol against anyone else using one. But when the competition has a couple thousand dollars of disposable income dedicated to tweaking their weakness then why bother?

[Urban Legend]

Longbow, I can assure you that the shoot you went too was not an IBO sanctioned shoot.  I think that is BS that they didn't let you shoot either of your bows.

[Guide Girl]

For me, first is there are no tournaments like that here where I live, and second, I hate target shooting. To me, it's monotonous to have to do so.
Maybe it's because I spend alot of time zeroing in bows and having to cock them so many times. I'd rather shoot hogs. You know, live targets that move.
It's not something that interests me personally. Maybe it's because I have opportunity to hunt so often. When I was a rifle hunter, it was the same. Everyone was excited to go shoot, and I dreaded going to the range to shoot. It was a chore.
But I say more power to those who love it!
Way to go Mark! Your the man!

[SPECIALIZED]

GG ,I kind of agree, I get bored easy, Have a lot of hunter friends same way.I see where some people shoot targets every day,maybe thousands of arrows weekly.Some people get off on Targets,others don't.
I like to shoot ,don't get me wrong. I am an experienced Bow hunter shooting maybe 100 Arrows per week and if I cant accurately place an arrow in the kill zone of a Deer,I really don't think shooting  thousands of arrows per week is going to help.If you like to shoot targets and get bullyseyes and that makes you happy,so be it.

I have a neighbor who shoots his bow all the time,bullseyes ,no problem.
But he always has a story about the Deer he just missed.

[Skinner 2]

SPECIALIZED said:

GG ,I kind of agree, I get bored easy, Have a lot of hunter friends same way.I see where some people shoot targets every day,maybe thousands of arrows weekly.Some people get off on Targets,others don't.
I like to shoot ,don't get me wrong. I am an experienced Bow hunter shooting maybe 100 Arrows per week and if I cant accurately place an arrow in the kill zone of a Deer,I really don't think shooting  thousands of arrows per week is going to help.If you like to shoot targets and get bullyseyes and that makes you happy,so be it.

I have a neighbor who shoots his bow all the time,bullseyes ,no problem.
But he always has a story about the Deer he just missed.

Here is another way to look at it. Stand toe to toe on a line with say 30 archers on a line for a national shoot. You feel pressure! You learn to shoot under this pressue and deer will not be missed. This is one more thing Tournament can teach but most people over look.

I was Sponsored by Browning for a few years before and after I got married. I loved to shoot Tournamnets, BUT not as much as I liked bowhunting. Along came my son and I walked away from Tournamnets. If I was going to be away from home it was for hunting. I walked away as Michigans Number 1 Indoor ranked Archer....A few were glad to see me leave:D.

When I shot league I made enough money from the dollar shoots to pay my league fee's How Most people cannot shoot under pressure. We would have a shoot off for the cash on ties. We shot at a 1" dot at 20 yards. Closest to center wins..... Well being the show-off and agitator I am I would step up to the line first..grab a bare shaft and spin it um for straightness. Well OK to show NO fletches. Then I would sent it 20 yards down range and be very close to if not on the dot. This is where the pressue would hit others and they would fail. They just saw a FINGER shooter place a bare shaft on the dot. These "good" shooter would buckle from the pressure and some missed by as far as two feet.

Funny story Last night of league we had a tie for first place team. My team and two people were missing. We had to shoot off for first. Being the team with high scores we had to give a decent handicap. Being two down we got penalized for the missing two also (WHO were at a IBO SHOOT BTW)! My last team member was just going to fold and give in. I gave him heck and said I would take on the team myself. So there we were. My partner shaking and me coaching him on. The other team well One was right behind me and I had a new shirt on my wife gave me. A "NO Fear" shirt. Said Does not play well with others...Seems other have a problem time loosing. That was ten years ago and when I see the four loosing members they still complain about the shoot off. Two have told me they would NEVER shoot againts me again. LOL heads are a terriable thing to mess with.


Shooting targets is NOT hard. Shooting targets under pressure is. Learn to shoot under pressure best place is tournaments! Targets are boring you say, make them not. When shooting with friends place wagers looser washes other trucks or caddies at the next shoot. It's fun to walk around a 3-D course and not have to carry a bow or quiver. Seeing your buddy carrying two bows and two quivers is priceless!

Skinner

[dennis]

Guide Girl said:

For me, first is there are no tournaments like that here where I live, and second, I hate target shooting. To me, it's monotonous to have to do so.
Maybe it's because I spend alot of time zeroing in bows and having to cock them so many times. I'd rather shoot hogs. You know, live targets that move.
It's not something that interests me personally. Maybe it's because I have opportunity to hunt so often. When I was a rifle hunter, it was the same. Everyone was excited to go shoot, and I dreaded going to the range to shoot. It was a chore.
But I say more power to those who love it!
Way to go Mark! Your the man!

Guess you never heard the ole saying that "practice makes perfect"........or maybe your a 1 in a million crossbow shooting prodigy, there fore practice would be so redundant.

[Sean]

I actually shoot more tournaments than hunt, I find the pressue at a much higher level than hunting. We have had crossbows in our tournamnets since the early 90's so stigma really isn't there anymore mainly because they can compare actually by scores that compounds are still far ahead as far a acuraccy goes, we found that a good crossbow shooter will equal a good fixed pins and release shooter consistantly. What shooting tournaments also does is really show who makes a quality crossbow and accessories and who doesn't. I have shot some I know will not make it through a Fita1(60 arrows,3per 2min). I think if more showd up it would also elevate the fun factor as well as show to Joe Public that crossbows are not the HollyWood weapon many make them out to be.

[Veroshooter]

Our club now allows crossbows at all events.  Two years ago we realized that we were missing out on a signifcant segment of shooters by not promoting crossbow participation.  Our 3d events now have a crossbow class and I wish more would come!

[Tenpoint TL-9]

My judgeing is good for 35 yards max. after that my guess goes down hill. That's why I don't go.

[Cyclonic]

I plan to next year! NAA, IBO, maybe NFAA>

[TPM]

Quote

My judging is good for 35 yards max. after that my guess goes down hill. That's why I don't go.

That's all the more reason you should go. 3D tournaments are an awesome way to improve your shooting and have fun in the off-season. My wife and I shoot about 6 or 7 tournaments in a year and spend a fair bit of time on the target and 3D range at our club. I am absolutely a better shooter for it when I hit the field in the fall.

[TBrom]

After speaking with Vaguru and Hoss, I've been trying to check into it. I'm getting absolutely nowhere in PA. I've tried contacting the IBO and all of the PA state reps. I've gotten one response that stated "The shoots are over for this year" that was it. I've offered to list all of the crossbow events on the PA website so crossbow shooters would know where and when the events were being held. No replies I'm starting to get the feeling maybe they really don't want crossbows participating?

[Cyclonic]

They are pretty much over for the year, one last shoot in Va. today. At Augusta archers. Sept. is normally the last month for 3-D. But, you are right, it is hard to find a 3-D range that allows crossbows. Ranges usually start advertising at local shops in February. Start looking around for flyers then. If they are holding any IBO sanctioned shoots, they should let you in. I will be shooting with vaguru at Augusta today.

[Lscha]

Cyclonic said:

They are pretty much over for the year, one last shoot in Va. today. At Augusta archers. Sept. is normally the last month for 3-D. But, you are right, it is hard to find a 3-D range that allows crossbows. Ranges usually start advertising at local shops in February. Start looking around for flyers then. If they are holding any IBO sanctioned shoots, they should let you in. I will be shooting with vaguru at Augusta today.

I hope you remembered to take your camera! Can't wait to hear how it went. Good luck!!

[SEW]

I have been an avid archer for 52 years and still am. Originally they were designed to facilitate hunting. The flattest trajectories were required to not be handicapped in range estimation. Stress on bows, noise, and unrealistic set-ups for hunting existed. All this due to not using the now common range finders. I preferred to hunt with lower poundage, more grains/lb, a quieter set-up than was needed to be competitive in 3D shooting.
If shoots were held with a more realistic set up, possibly more people would participate. If I learned to use the rangefinding abilities of my Hawke scope maybe this could be legally overcome.
Anyway, this is why I didn't compete after range finders became common(started with Spectrum 500 - used a wheelbarrow to carry it to the stand).
Have things changed now?

[vaguru]

TB,

Don't get upset yet.  This years season is over.  The shoots will start becoming listed again in January on the IBO tournament page.  All IBO sanctioned shoots are REQUIRED to let crossbows shoot as there is a class for them.  If you find a club not allowing them, they will lose the right to hold IBO shoots.  Remind the club about that, telling them you will call the IBO on the next business day.  I have never had a problem shooting at any IBO event, the clubs are well aware of the rules.

SEW,

You confused me with some of your statements.  Rangefinders are NOT allowed in IBO, and to my knowlegde, never were.  Crossbow rules ARE a realistic setup, not the same as vertical.

Ischa,

I had my camera with me, but there were no exceptional target groupings today.  I'll let cyclonic give you the lowdown on the shoot.  If you can't wait, let me know. lol

[Cyclonic]

Basically, the lowdown is I didn't shoot too good. Vaguru, on the other hand, shot right well. The course was a little odd, 15 3-D targets, and 15 paper targets. I had trouble most of the day. First my serving broke, luckily vaguru lives close by the range, and reserved my string for me. If not for that, I would not have been able to finish. I'm still learning Trixie's arrow flight, so my yaradage was questionable, at best. I had the shakes too, which is unusual for me. At least one of us shot good today! Just wasn't me. Oh well, the next few months gives me time to spend with Trixie and learn her habits, so that next 3-D season I'll be ready.
Thanks again vaguru, for fixing my serving, and for the tips on my new bow. I think adding the wieght will be a big help. I'll check with the local shop, and see if they're shooting 3-D indoors again this fall and winter, maybe we can get some shooting in. I think they are able to shoot out to 40 yds. Last year he told me we could shoot crossbows.

[SEW]

vaguru said:

TB,



SEW,

You confused me with some of your statements.  Rangefinders are NOT allowed in IBO, and to my knowlegde, never were.  Crossbow rules ARE a realistic setup, not the same as vertical.

Yes, I know rangefinders were not allowed in IBO and assume they are still not. I was referencing taking my large manual rangefinder, years ago, to my deer stand. I was kidding, it wasn't that big but was big by today's standards. My bows and practice were set up for hunting. I am aware that original competition was designed to facilitate hunting. Then it went in it's own direction that no longer facilitated hunting at all, IMO. It became a thing of it's own. Auto racing used to facilitate new innovations on production cars but now has gone off in a different direction where relatively few improvements from auto racing make it to production cars. This is due to the rules imposed on the cars used in racing. I see a parallel here.
My shooting is centered on hunting and hunting alone. The use of a rangefinder separated the hunting set-up and the 3-d set-up quite a bit. The 3-d set-up is for accuracy and speed to get a flat trajectory to minimize range estimation error. The hunting set-up doesn't need to consider trajectory nearly as much. All this is for v-bows. I obviously do not know the rules nor principles of h-bow competition. If it facilitates the use of a crossbow for hunting, then I'll likely be interested.
Sorry for any confusion.