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if it can really deliver close to 480 with 440 grain arrow i would have to have one.

Why 440 grain. That about the normal build weight for a 20" Synal Tapp or Bee with a 110 grain insert, nock bushing, vanes and your choice of a 100 grain head......the sweet spot is right there i.m.o.
Yep! My 22" Tapps weigh in right at 447 gr...... Perfect for me!
 

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Bird, mentions too about not wanting to deal with the weight of the Garmin or Oracle X.
Both are the same weight really. I have the Garmin and its un believable piece getting a target locked indication on the scope is just so cool. But from a real hunting stand point lugging this sucker out on to state land is not likely to happen when i have a few other lighter weight choices. When I can use my electric bike and cart i will use the Vapor with the Garmin unit at the bean fields.
 

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I have a R500e on pre-order as well....I am rapidly losing my confidence. I’m not sure I will get it before hunting season. Even if it comes in time, I am wondering if these delays are an omen of design and material flaws. Right now, a Tenpoint Vapor 470 is starting to look better and better.....
 

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I have a R500e on pre-order as well....I am rapidly losing my confidence. I’m not sure I will get it before hunting season. Even if it comes in time, I am wondering if these delays are an omen of design and material flaws. Right now, a Tenpoint Vapor 470 is starting to look better and better.....
I'd be working on a backup plan ASAP! They are cutting it too close for comfort.....
 
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The late release is enough to keep me at bay till next year anyway. Why not let the rest of the team Genia pig it for ya.

By this time next year you will get a lot better bow and much cheaper too. Just the way it always works.
 

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The late release is enough to keep me at bay till next year anyway. Why not let the rest of the team Genia pig it for ya.

By this time next year you will get a lot better bow and much cheaper too. Just the way it always works.
You are absolutely correct...
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 · (Edited)
Duke, I agree.

Here is the way I look at when I buy a new crossbow. I personally hunt with a crossbow 98% of the season. We only get 2 weeks to hunt with a rifle. I'd rather put the money into a crossbow than a rifle.

Most factory rifles today will shoot very accurately without having to go with a custom build. I've been down that road and sold all my custom rifles except for one with a Sporter barrel. Most of those hole for hole shooters that shot lights out still needed loaded ammo to shoot great as most factory rifles do. The heavy guns aren't for lugging around the woods either. I can shoot 1/2" 3 shot groups at 300 yards with a factory rifle that has minimal work done. Just a bed job and some tweaking of loads with the right bullet .

Why waist money on a gun that will sit in the safe to use maybe 2 or 3 days a year? And, I can shoot a crossbow without having to leave the house.

At this point I won't be buying into a $4000 contraption of a crossbow but I'm sure it's a must have for some.

I'd like to have one that shoots 500fps though. LOL It would be some fun.

I'll buy a good box blind instead to hunt comfy and sleep in from time to time. Why not?
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if it can really deliver close to 480 with 440 grain arrow i would have to have one.

Why 440 grain........? Thats about the normal build weight for a 20" Spynal Tapp or Bee with a 110 grain insert, nock bushing, vanes and your choice of a 100 grain head......the sweet spot is right there i.m.o.
my build too.
 

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the real thing to consider here. Is that if you shoot this bow or any bow at 500 f.p.s with a 400grain arrow you are dri firing the bow anyway you slice it. It would be the same as taking a 350 grain arrow and firing it of your Ravin or new Tenpoint that you own now. Maybe even worse. So unless your a bit of a fool why would you do this......?
So having said that your not really going to get 500 f.p.s probably more like 370 or 380 at best.
Is that a significant jump for the money and maintance to keep it going......?

what do you think.....? For some it certainly will be

The only other gain could be to shoot a real heavy arrow at about 460 f.p.s
Which would help you some place i guess. A hurricane maybe or for shooting though car doors or something.

what do you think.....?
What I think ... is Ravin doesn't have a history of "over reporting" speed numbers. They've been the one outfit that has been pretty honest.

I also think, with great delay and secrecy is born audience speculation. Why the delay? Trouble surrounding hitting 500fps? Getting 500fps and keeping the crossbow together with the arrow weight needed to get 500fps? In other words did they need a 385gr arrow to do 500fps and it was a canon going off and splintered limbs after 50 shots? Did they keep making modifications with heavier arrows and cam and/or limb modifications looking for the combination that can go 500fps and stay together? Are they going to do a Ten Point and advertise 470fps and send heavy arrows that do 445fps? The 500gr arrow business is some kind of a flag...lol Either a great customer service flag for providing an arrow capable of African plains game. Or a red flag of reliability, noise, vibration, or accuracy issues.

Another question I have: "since Ravin has no rail and is much more spine sensitive than a traditional crossbow platform, is 500gr a weight that Victory (or BEE) whoever is making Ravin arrows these days can handle?" Is this introduction issue arrow related?
 
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If the crossbow is designed to shoot a 400 grain arrow I don't see where it's like a dry fire at all.

That is like saying I'm dry firing every crossbow I own just because the older models shot a 400 grain arrow let's say at around 350fps.
There is no bow made that is "designed" to counteract a dry fire condition. There are plenty that ignore it but none of them overcome it. The arrow weight to limb draw weight is an absolute science and there is no engineering (to date) that changes this.

Arrow weight reduction and/or draw rate increases, equates to a shorter limb life. This is a simple fact that is the only thing which is constant and unchanging.
If an unbreakable limb could be made, it would have been made. There will be no new material forthcoming and the old material breaks. Period.
 

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Maybe and good point but a wheel only has 360 degrees of rotation and only so many offset points. They are not going to reinvent the wheel.

When you go to an extreme parallel limb design and depend more on cam rotation rather tha limb deflection to propel the arrow, you might be very surprised with the result.
I'm thinking Ravin would not be shipping the 500s with 400 grain arrows unless their engineers knew the limbs and strings could take the stress.
Personally, I'm quite happy with my R10 and never had any problems with a complete pass thru on any deer. But I'm using a 434 grain arrow and my shots have all been under 40 yards.

I know one thing for sure. If the R500 proves to be reliable and accurate at long range and relatively maintenance free with a 400 grain arrow, it will be attractive to those who prefer not to use a heavy auto ranging scope. In fact, I'm betting that new Ravin scope with the adjustable turret for elevation will be very popular on the R500.
We shall see soon.
 

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Ravin stated 500 fps with a 400gn arrow. I stated earlier (months ago) but was shot down that there is a 500gn arrow, I don't believe you're going to get 500 feet per second. But I could be wrong.
 

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Ravin stated 500 fps with a 400gn arrow. I stated earlier (months ago) but was shot down that there is a 500gn arrow, I don't believe you're going to get 500 feet per second. But I could be wrong.
Bottom line ... is all this is just forum chatter. Nobody knows what's going on and nobody knows the when, where and hows about the R500 & R500E. Like most "sky is falling" fears in life it's better to just wait and see what we're dealing with rather than wildly speculating. It's fun playing keyboard prognosticators and exercising each other's minds with point & counterpoint discussions. Yet, it's really a "wait & see" situation. Which is a testimonial in itself for NOT being first in line and paying $3,500.00+ for the privilege of being a Ravin field test subject for the R500....lol
 

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Bottom line ... is all this is just forum chatter. Nobody knows what's going on and nobody knows the when, where and hows about the R500 & R500E. Like most "sky is falling" fears in life it's better to just wait and see what we're dealing with rather than wildly speculating. It's fun playing keyboard prognosticators and exercising each other's minds with point & counterpoint discussions. Yet, it's really a "wait & see" situation. Which is a testimonial in itself for NOT being first in line and paying $3,500.00+ for the privilege of being a Ravin field test subject for the R500....lol
All true.
What I suspect is that any real issues will be quietly taken care of between Ravin and the buyer, as nobody (here at least) is gonna fess up to being a lab rat which paid $3500 to inherit problems in testing.
I certainly hope we hear from all the rats when they suffer the ills of poor planning and over marketing, but I dont expect too.
 

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Owning an R29X ... and reading about all the falderal that owners are going through with strings, cables, nocks and arrows of the 450fps crossbow; makes me wonder if the R500 is the solution to the R29X ills, or the unfortunate Gordian knot that epitomizes and multiplies those issues? :unsure:
 
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RELEASE THE KRAKEN!
 

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Owning an R29X ... and reading about all the falderal that owners are going through with strings, cables, nocks and arrows of the 450fps crossbow; makes me wonder if the R500 is the solution to the R29X ills, or the unfortunate Gordian knot that epitomizes and multiplies those issues? :unsure:
Good questions………I think😊
 

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Owning an R29X ... and reading about all the falderal that owners are going through with strings, cables, nocks and arrows of the 450fps crossbow; makes me wonder if the R500 is the solution to the R29X ills, or the unfortunate Gordian knot that epitomizes and multiplies those issues? :unsure:
Duke,
I'm guessing some Ravin owners didn't do their homework before buying their R29X and failed to read this statement directly from the Ravin website:
  • "NEVER USE NON-RAVIN BRAND ARROWS OR NOCKS. Non-Ravin arrows or nocks not accurately designed for use with the Ravin crossbow may not have the same designs, dimensions, tolerances, or materials, potentially interfering with the operation of the anti-dry fire or trigger mechanisms, creating a risk of serious injury or death. Use only Ravin branded arrows with Ravin clip-on nocks recommended for your Ravin crossbow.
  • NEVER SHOOT A CROSSBOW WITH A WORN OR DAMAGED BOWSTRING, AND NEVER SHOOT A CROSSBOW WITH A CENTER SERVING THAT HAS SEPARATED. Firing your Ravin crossbow with worn or damaged strings and cables may interfere with the fit of the nock on the bowstring, causing the trigger and anti-dry fire system to not operate as designed.
  • NEVER USE NON-RAVIN® STRINGS AND CABLES ON YOUR RAVIN® CROSSBOW. NEVER RE-SERVE OLD BOWSTRINGS. Replace strings and cables at least every two years or 400 shots, whichever occurs first, or sooner if wear or damage is visible, or if there is any separation on the serving. Improperly maintained strings could break and/or cause a dry fire event in the crossbow."
IMO, folks who purchase a Ravin AND violate the above don't really have anyone to blame but themselves.
Of course, there are also Ravin owners who realize that they are violating Ravin's rules but don't bitch and moan about it when something doesn't work out like they planned.
Others just try to share what has worked best for them but also clarify that if they don't own a particular model, they can't necessarily provide recommendations for improvement.
Just my 2 pennies worth - nothin more and nothin less.
 
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Duke,
I'm guessing some Ravin owners didn't do their homework before buying their R29X and failed to read this statement directly from the Ravin website:
  • "NEVER USE NON-RAVIN BRAND ARROWS OR NOCKS. Non-Ravin arrows or nocks not accurately designed for use with the Ravin crossbow may not have the same designs, dimensions, tolerances, or materials, potentially interfering with the operation of the anti-dry fire or trigger mechanisms, creating a risk of serious injury or death. Use only Ravin branded arrows with Ravin clip-on nocks recommended for your Ravin crossbow.
  • NEVER SHOOT A CROSSBOW WITH A WORN OR DAMAGED BOWSTRING, AND NEVER SHOOT A CROSSBOW WITH A CENTER SERVING THAT HAS SEPARATED. Firing your Ravin crossbow with worn or damaged strings and cables may interfere with the fit of the nock on the bowstring, causing the trigger and anti-dry fire system to not operate as designed.
  • NEVER USE NON-RAVIN® STRINGS AND CABLES ON YOUR RAVIN® CROSSBOW. NEVER RE-SERVE OLD BOWSTRINGS. Replace strings and cables at least every two years or 400 shots, whichever occurs first, or sooner if wear or damage is visible, or if there is any separation on the serving. Improperly maintained strings could break and/or cause a dry fire event in the crossbow."
IMO, folks who purchase a Ravin AND violate the above don't really have anyone to blame but themselves.
Of course, there are also Ravin owners who realize that they are violating Ravin's rules but don't bitch and moan about it when something doesn't work out like they planned.
Others just try to share what has worked best for them but also clarify that if they don't own a particular model, they can't necessarily provide recommendations for improvement.
Just my 2 pennies worth - nothin more and nothin less.
I read ... a law professor's article years ago stating that the inundation of rules & regulations is an alibi or good argument for acquittal in court. Nobody can legally or logically be expected to know and understand them all. Nowadays, seems the first ten pages of any 14 page owner's manual is lawyer BS warnings, cover their arse crapola, insurance dictates, & buyer don'ts. When they send a ¼" book for a manual, AND a 1 page sheet labeled "Quick Start," it's a sure indication that nobody reads all the 14 page BS, everyone just jumps passed to the actual "how to make it go" stuff, and the manufacturer & their lawyers know it.

Throw in the the self serving tripe that comes from so many manufacturers which half the customers rightfully disregard, the inherent distrust in all marketing, and the odds of anyone actually reading all those warnings is relatively low. All the arrow, nock, illuminated nock, string and cable "falderal" going on here isn't being done by stupid people. They're smart & experienced and in the case of strings and cables, evidently are trying to fix a factory deficiency. In the case of the arrows, they're looking for better precision and in some cases cost reduction. Nothing earth shattering, new or unexpected in either case. Besides "somebody" is making those factory strings and "somebody" is making those factory arrows. Ravin ain't doing it themselves. Just another example why buyers don't trust sellers and why buyers go aftermarket for better quality accoutrements and accessories. It's not like they're buying aftermarket limbs or aftermarket trigger boxes.

That said; after about 20 years of hot-roding and making "improvements" to my cars & trucks I realized the engineers at GM know what they're doing. (most of the time...lol) The more "improvements" you make the more problems you make. If you want to carry more in your F150 or K1500 pickup, buy a F250 or HD2500! Adding springs or air bags just lets you snap axles or blow transmissions. When I order a truck these days EVERYTHING I want is factory installed. Might cost a few dollars more for spray-on bed liner, a tow hitch, or running boards but it fits, and there's no BS. The farther you get from factory stock, the more headaches.

Apparently, it's a similar case with the R29X. Only difference being my Silverado didn't come with cheapo Walmart tires that will wear out in 1,500 miles and GM won't let me replace them with a set of premium Michelins. ;)
 

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Duke,
I believe Ravin is providing better quality strings and arrows than in the past. Furthermore, the CBN bunch is waaay more picky than the average crossbow hunter.

But to your point, when you spend big dollars for a R29X, you would expect higher quality components.
 
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