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Discussion Starter #1
187603

...Barnett HiperFlite looks like this:

187604


So, if the cams are going to have stationary axles fixed on the riser, why use composite limbs for spring action and storage of energy? Why not just use a plain steel coil spring in the body of the crossbow?
This will be with a damper, obviously, either a real pneumatic damper, or something like foam padding in between the coil spring segments; a bit like a secondary coil, made of foam, inside the steel coil.

The advantages of a steel coil spring, is that you can have infinite durability, life-span, any amount of force/poundage can be designed into it etc.
 

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Going the way of the Lancehead but with limbs?
 

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Going the way of the Lancehead but with limbs?
Much simpler and lighter and faster than a Lancehead. No limbs; limbs means "elastic moving bits that can store energy"; it is just a riser with cams on it, like the Barnett.

Could be narrower than drawn, I suppose, and with string on the inside of the cams, cables on the outside, if people prefer it for some reason (like on the Barnett). But this decreases and narrows the string angle at the arrow base and I think it's a bad thing in general.
 

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The advantages of a steel coil spring, is that you can have infinite durability, life-span, any amount of force/poundage can be designed into it etc.
Steel fatigues with use but still, very interesting design.
Is there a timeline in place for a rollout of this design or is it conceptual only?
Thanks for sharing.
 
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Nice concept, you should build it, but with the string coming off the front of the wheels instead of the rear to gain more power stroke.
Could also use nitrogen cylinder or vacuum instead of steel springs.
 

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Build it and see. Much like the nitro piston powered Talisman, when you get rid of the limbs, it is no longer a crossbow. Just an arrow launching device.
But I bet it would be fun to build and play with!
 
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Barnett's next problem child.
I have no connection to crossbow makers; I just had an idea. It is mechanically sound, and can probably be implemented as cheaply as conventional composite limb designs, which is the rub.

Having said this and thought about it some more, the two sides of this xbow might turn out to only be balanced if the top end of the spring runs in a slot, or is better constrained from sideways movement in some other way, which will be more expensive to make.
If that turns out to be a problem then it might be simpler to have two independent springs for each cable, side by side in the body, or back to back at the front. The advantage of a single (hefty) spring close to the hand-grip is that it all balances out better ergonomically.
 

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Nice concept, you should build it, but with the string coming off the front of the wheels instead of the rear to gain more power stroke.
Could also use nitrogen cylinder or vacuum instead of steel springs.
Ah, yes. I was only thinking of the string angle when drawn; didn't consider overall length and power-stroke.
 

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Could be narrower than drawn, I suppose, and with string on the inside of the cams, cables on the outside, if people prefer it for some reason (like on the Barnett). But this decreases and narrows the string angle at the arrow base and I think it's a bad thing in general.
You should definitely put your design together with the string coming off the front of the cams. Ravin, Scorpyd, Mission, KI, and others are all successfully able to handle the narrow string angle now. Your design would be considered outdated if you have the string coming off the rear of the cams.
 
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View attachment 187603
...Barnett HiperFlite looks like this:

View attachment 187604

So, if the cams are going to have stationary axles fixed on the riser, why use composite limbs for spring action and storage of energy? Why not just use a plain steel coil spring in the body of the crossbow?
This will be with a damper, obviously, either a real pneumatic damper, or something like foam padding in between the coil spring segments; a bit like a secondary coil, made of foam, inside the steel coil.

The advantages of a steel coil spring, is that you can have infinite durability, life-span, any amount of force/poundage can be designed into it etc.
View attachment 187603
...Barnett HiperFlite looks like this:

View attachment 187604

So, if the cams are going to have stationary axles fixed on the riser, why use composite limbs for spring action and storage of energy? Why not just use a plain steel coil spring in the body of the crossbow?
This will be with a damper, obviously, either a real pneumatic damper, or something like foam padding in between the coil spring segments; a bit like a secondary coil, made of foam, inside the steel coil.

The advantages of a steel coil spring, is that you can have infinite durability, life-span, any amount of force/poundage can be designed into it etc.
I believe that Pa. doesn't allow use of springs in a bow.
 

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Ah, yes. I was only thinking of the string angle when drawn; didn't consider overall length and power-stroke.
@cscx888 you are definitely going to have to build it and prove it out if you want any chance of getting it licensed.

There should also be inexpensive ways of being able to guide a single coil spring end in a straight line and with minimal friction. Only one way to find out...
 

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Barnett's next problem child.
Get out fo the past and enter the future. Barnett has been making lots of great xbows for the last three plus years. Trigger tech alone makes this a major value add.

This ongoing hate for one particular Xbow manufacturer is a road to no where. At the least you sound elitist. Also, it creates tit for tat negative energy and boy I could go down that road with Scorpyd, Ravin, Killer Instinct and TenPoint but I choose not to. I find your comments inflammatory to those that like to hunt and have options.

There is a life lesson taught by old school parents. If you can't say something nice don't say nothing at all. How about tipping your cap at the attempt to innovate and to me it looks like Barnett can be apart of that culture.

Just like so many other Xbow companies that often get a pass for their poor build issues their owners have to experience issues in the field after spending major coin. Come-on brother think more constructively. If you had a bad experience duly noted. Me, I have had them with a leading OEM listed above but I'm not going to burry my head in the sand and make generalized inflammatory comments bout that OEM. Actually, I plan to revisit and buy once they get their issues resolved because I feel they innovate. Life is not perfect. Now if paying 2k for a Xbow makes you feel more legit then it's your money and shoot on but enough with the negative rhetoric it offers no value to the community. Brand name does not drive me. Reliability does and Trigger tech is a major play for me. What I've owned has been nothing less then exceptional with Barnett TS370, Raptor Pro STR and TS390. Do they require TLC, sure but no Xbow is perfect out of the box if you have a discerning eye.
 

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That design would be illegal in Pa.
Xbows are facing lots of limitations. Colorado included. Your comments are duly noted.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
@cscx888 you are definitely going to have to build it and prove it out if you want any chance of getting it licensed.

There should also be inexpensive ways of being able to guide a single coil spring end in a straight line and with minimal friction. Only one way to find out...
It would likely turn out to be unnecessary though; it might literally work with a coil attached below the rail at one end, with the other end hanging on the cables with a bit of tension. This does allow for some lateral movement of the string, but the out-of-balance forces would also be low; it would only be things like small mass/inertia variations in the cams or the two sides of the string.
 

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There is a device that works in a similar way but with levers instead of cams. It also ( in the versions I’ve seen) used elastic tubing, but could just as easily use a coil spring. It’s called the woodland flipper. The front of cam string makes sense, in terms of overall length vs power stroke, but unless your cam system ( which would have to be very large, being fixed to the frame) has some let off, keeping center serving in good shape is going to be a challenge.
 
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