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If you HAD to buy a 2021 Model today, which would it be?

  • TenPoint Siege RS410

    Votes: 24 22.2%
  • TenPoint Havoc RS440

    Votes: 11 10.2%
  • TenPoint Havoc RS440 with Garmin XERO Scope/Rangefinder

    Votes: 4 3.7%
  • Excalibur TwinStrike

    Votes: 12 11.1%
  • Swat X1

    Votes: 32 29.6%
  • Ravin R500

    Votes: 14 13.0%
  • Ravin R500E (Electric Cranker)

    Votes: 8 7.4%
  • Ravin R18

    Votes: 3 2.8%
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Discussion Starter #101
Not one issue with the 16's out of my Siege with over 200 shots. With the Sig BDX mounted I have shot 5" groups to 125 yards. I shot 20's out of the same bow with excellent results as well. Both being 400 grains total. However, I also found that they are not cheap if you don't investigate alternatives.

One element we may be overlooking past the pretty paint job is the customer service. A person should buy whatever tickles their fancy, just be sure the person from the manufacture on the other end of the phone call, or voice mail, is responsive when things go bad.

What a great country we have that permits us to have all these real cool weapons. All we need to do now is figure out which one's the DNR will permit to be used for hunting. I would surely drop a dime to the DNR and ask before a person opens their wallet. Just say'n
Very good info, observations and recommendations, as always, FD.
Thank you.
 

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George,
When I was shooting a friend’s Micro 335, shortly after they came out, I shot the “quills” out to 60 yards and was unimpressed. My M380/20” STs was much more accurate @60. The “quills” were ok to 40, fait @ 50 and unacceptable @60. I tried my 20” STs and it was much better but not equal to the M380. 22” arrows were much better out of the Micro but still behind the Matrix. The 200# Vortex/20 & 22” was more accurate yet @ 60. Both limb width and arrow length were factors in accuracy.

For this reason, I questioned the shorter 10-Pt arrows.
 

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It's not the bow for me but you can't help but think of how many disabled hunters will be able to hunt again thanks to the electric crank system on the Ravin R500e.
A friend of mine hunted with a Parker Concorde for several years before he passed. It was a very heavy rig but it got him back in the field doing what he loved most.
 

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TP Havoc 440 , the hard part is how much I want to pay for optics ? If I spend to much the swat is my runner up...
So how much for a dozen of Ten Point 16" arrows? Think arrow price gents. Just sayin'.
 
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Discussion Starter #108
So how much for a dozen of Ten Point 16" arrows? Think arrow price gents. Just sayin'.
Listed on the TenPoint site, same price as the 20" IIRC.
 

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KI is a comparatively new company as far as taking a design and bringing it into production from the ground up.

Their first was the SWAT which is a classic crossbow and an incredible value. The pivot bolt problem was highly publicized and apparently affected a significant # of the original SWATs(not mine with well over 2,000 shots and still on the same S&Cs, and limb bolts).

Maybe KI got too confident, because the SWAT XP didn’t enjoy such success. It had design deficiencies plus poor S&Cs. It was extremely fast, incredibly accurate but ate servings; and the limbs had problems. However, the limb problems were less than 3 major, highly respected brands of crossbows. New cables which very slightly detuned the bow and that had much better serving, largely corrected the XP’s limb and S&C’s problems. But, its hard to make a good second, first impression. The Corvair and Fiero are classic examples: disasterous first years, class acts by the last year’s of production. Still the model’s fate was sealed from near the beginning. Testing on the public may look good to the pencil pushers but not to the public.

I admire KI’s intense desire to continue to improve. They have taken every issue with the XP, addressed it, plus a number of areas not even previously addressed publically and tried to not only correct every one of those but added a # of very innovative improvements. Simple is good . The very gentle but highly efficient cams may be the greatest innovation. Letoff near arrow release plus 50% letoff at full draw makes for extreme gentleness, quietness, less serving wear and longivity. Keep in mind that this sub-25” crossbow is shooting full sized 20” arrows (compliments of the patented rear latching mechanism) verses the 16“ - 16 1/2” arrows of most other ultra compact crossbows.

I still have confidence that third time’s charm.
Enlarge the cams from the x1 and use on the xp.
 

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Enlarge the cams from the x1 and use on the xp.
With inserts in the riser to help limb integrity, appropriate length S&Cs to keep about 415-420’/sec, with the very same cams (cams cost a lot to develope and set up to manufacture), and positioning the cams a little more towards the center of the limbs, I think the X1 cams would work well. Remember, the power stroke is much longer on the XP and the limbs are 200# ++. The weaknesses of the XP are well understood so a lot of potential modification could be done.
 

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Im looking at the rs400 viper it came out last year, plenty fast as I say anything over 400fps is overkill, I was looking at the siege but can't get past the 16inch arrows, one little weakness in your target and those arrows will be in past the fletching, vs having that extra 4inches of arrow, I'm not into the ultra short xbows either I just like my regular length but no longer than 32inch 29-30 ideal
 

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With inserts in the riser to help limb integrity, appropriate length S&Cs to keep about 415-420’/sec, with the very same cams (cams cost a lot to develope and set up to manufacture), and positioning the cams a little more towards the center of the limbs, I think the X1 cams would work well. Remember, the power stroke is much longer on the XP and the limbs are 200# ++. The weaknesses of the XP are well understood so a lot of potential modification could be done.
Would not the cams need to be bigger to accomodate the full rotation of the longer power stroke? If the same cams would work that would be outstanding.
 

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I'm happy with my Scorpyds to be redundant but, if I had to pick one from the multiple choice table at the top here, I'd have to go with the X1 for sure. It's platform is the exact thing a crossbow is, it's simple and it even totally encases the arrow while you have it cocked and loaded. I would definitely use a capture Frirenock so that the arrow wouldn't slide out of the barrel. It's small and light with good power that's accurate and it still uses 2 good control cables instead of 4. Which I think is more practical than to have to deal with 4 tiny little cables. This is just my thoughts and opinions on this...
 

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Discussion Starter #115
I'm happy with my Scorpyds to be redundant but if I had to pick on from the multiple choice table at the top here, I'd have to go with the X1 for sure. It's platform is the exact thing a crossbow is, it's simple and it even totally encases the arrow while you have it cocked and loaded. I would definitely use a capture Frirenock so that the arrow wouldn't slide out of the barrel. It's small and light with good power that's accurate and it still uses 2 good control cables instead of 4. Which I think is more practical than to have to deal with 4 tiny little cables. This is just my thoughts and opinions on this...
Marty, it has been highly recommended, I think by OLDFLYER, to NOT use a Capture Nock as is may hit inside the barrel or something like that.
 

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[QUOTE="Martymig, post: 1415020, member:
I would definitely use a capture Frirenock so that the arrow wouldn't slide out of the barrel. I
[/QUOTE]


If it's the same as the XP which I am sure it is the latchy lever thingy holds onto the back of the arrow. Can't come out unless lever is slid. How's that for technical jargon! 😁
 

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Marty, it has been highly recommended, I think by OLDFLYER, to NOT use a Capture Nock as is may hit inside the barrel or something like that.
[QUOTE="Martymig, post: 1415020, member:
I would definitely use a capture Frirenock so that the arrow wouldn't slide out of the barrel. I
If it's the same as the XP which I am sure it is the latchy lever thingy holds onto the back of the arrow. Can't come out unless lever is slid. How's that for technical jargon! 😁
[/QUOTE]
Hows that for luck..... i guess i better really take good care of my Scorpyds.
But you said the arrow gets held in by some mechanisms on the bow so, I'd still go with the X1 because of its platform.
 

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Im looking at the rs400 viper it came out last year, plenty fast as I say anything over 400fps is overkill, I was looking at the siege but can't get past the 16inch arrows, one little weakness in your target and those arrows will be in past the fletching, vs having that extra 4inches of arrow, I'm not into the ultra short xbows either I just like my regular length but no longer than 32inch 29-30 ideal
Good point ... about the 16" arrows and disappearing into targets. Never thought about that. I've wrecked fletching on quite a few 22" arrows burying them in targets; 16" would be going through like bullets ...lol
 
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