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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello All,

I've been away for a min. Just bought a new vertical bow for the '13-'14 deer season. After about 75-100 shots a day.. My shoulders have started to become really sore. and it's this weird seperation with the cartilage, kinda like eating the grissel off chicken. I only shoot 60#, and pulling it isn't a problem. My range of motion hasn't been interrupted. Just slight pain, swelling, and the aforementioned cartilage popping thing,.

How does that affect pulling a #150 crossbow. I thought that used more of my back muscles for XBow, so that if the doc does have me on some type of rest. My hunting season doesn't end. Would now be the time to invest in a crank cocking device.

Thought?
 

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I Didn't Do It.
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If you are going to be shooting a lot of arrows, I would go with the crank cocker to give your shoulder a rest. You can always take the crank cocker off for just hunting where you only need to cock perhaps a couple of times. I have a bad back and hand cocking gets to me after a cocking the xbow more times for target shooting. 75 shots or more is a lot per day. FWIW, some crank cockers are more trouble than their worth. Just my two cents.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hey Highlander.. I've chosen to slow down a lot.. I really love archery.. Probably too much. I've been pretty much shooting V-Bow everyday for the last 2 years. X-Bow, not as much with the Jennings giving me the issues that it did.
 
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I Didn't Do It.
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Before back injury, I was like you shooting my vertical all the time. I loved it. Sorry to hear about your injury or whatever is causing it. These shoulder type problems seem to be difficult to overcome & are easily aggravated, especially as you age.
 

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I used to literally shoot my vertical bow every day. Might only be 6 arrows, but I shot them. Then I started having issues with numbness in my forearms and hands. I thought it was carpal tunnel. Turned out, after ten years, that I had nerve damage in my neck due to a compressed vertebrae. It was apparently caused by drawing a 65# bow for all those years. Now I'm religated to shooting maybe 5 arrowes with the vertical and a crank on my new crossbow. See a Dr. before you do more damage.
 
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If you want to keep shooting your vertical bow put a Draw-Loc on it.
 
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krealitygroup I have two bad shoulders that have been worked on. I would go with the crank cocking device ASAP. Try to save what movement you now have, why push your luck. My crossbow has 185 Lb limbs, yet the barnett crank only takes about 16 Lbs of force to turn the crank and pull the string back. If I did not have the crank I would stuck here reading posts all the time, rather than shooting my bow.
 

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The cranks will teach you patience and save you a lot of pain. When I first started using them I was somewhat frustrated as to how much time I took between shots. I quickly learned that the crank is a much more equal draw than a painful shoulder, which resulted in much better accuracy. I then accepted my lesson in patience!
 

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I agree with Highlander, get the crank and forego it for hunting if you can. Cranks are slow and aggravating, but not as much as shoulder surgery. My hunting partner has a replacement shoulder....and cocks a 200# Exocet with the string cocker. He goes slow and steady. It works for him without the crank. Check with your Dr.
I too enjoyed shooting vertical bows and shot 20-50 arrows 4-5 days a week. I only shot 58# but still have problems drawing when the weather turned cold and I have been sitting in the tree for a while. My solution was the crossbow....I haven't looked back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Pa Pa Jack said:
I used to literally shoot my vertical bow every day. Might only be 6 arrows, but I shot them. Then I started having issues with numbness in my forearms and hands. I thought it was carpal tunnel. Turned out, after ten years, that I had nerve damage in my neck due to a compressed vertebrae. It was apparently caused by drawing a 65# bow for all those years. Now I'm religated to shooting maybe 5 arrowes with the vertical and a crank on my new crossbow. See a Dr. before you do more damage.
I'm actually having numbness in the hands and forearms.. That sucks.. I'm a keyboard player for a living, so I'll get that stuff checked out right away. I thought it might be circulation issues from diabetes. No good.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
bowman81 said:
I agree with Highlander, get the crank and forego it for hunting if you can. Cranks are slow and aggravating, but not as much as shoulder surgery. My hunting partner has a replacement shoulder....and cocks a 200# Exocet with the string cocker. He goes slow and steady. It works for him without the crank. Check with your Dr.
I too enjoyed shooting vertical bows and shot 20-50 arrows 4-5 days a week. I only shot 58# but still have problems drawing when the weather turned cold and I have been sitting in the tree for a while. My solution was the crossbow....I haven't looked back.
Man.. I'm only 31.. I'm too young for all these muscle/bone issues. The older guy that's teaching me how to hunt, keeps trying to put me in a tree stand.. I've done it twice, and haven't been successful yet. However I got my first one on the ground.. Give me a ground blind on private low land anyday with a bow.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
For now, I'm taking Aleve, Vitamins, and Osteo-Biflex.. It's good for joints.. I wouldn't be shooting so hard right now if it wasn't for it being deer season. I gotta fill my tags.. So I got overobsessed with form and hitting small targets. Too much. I have one hunt in IL Monday morning. I'll have heat pads on them for the rest of the weekend, and rest from shooting this week (other than the hunt, but that should be 2 shots 2 kills prayerfully. After this deer season.. I'm giving the bow a rest.

On the bright side.. I can hit a penny at 20 broadside. 1/3..
 

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Throughout my younger years I simply LOVED everything to do with a compound bow...hence the name GA bow man. I shot targets late summer getting ready for hunting season then hunted the entire season from mid Sept until Jan 1 with my bow. After deer season ended I shot 3-D tournaments and that carried me up into the warm part of spring/summer where I spent the rest of the off season shooting fish (daytime and nitetime shooting). I guess as I got older I worked longer hours behind a desk and computer and gradually got more and more out of shape. Now at 58 years old I find it uncomfortable, even painful, trying to pull back even 60#'s on my 80% letoff V-bow. I found it so much so that I had all but forgotten about bowhunting until I ran across this site. After quite a bit of reading and asking questions I ordered my 1st and only crossbow last year, the Excal, and have found the blood is still pumping red over hitting the woods with a bow again. This time it's with the horizontal bow though.
 

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ScorpyD ACLEUS 460
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Hi Krealitygroup,
Maybe I can shed some light on a couple of things that may help.
You're probably not aware of it, but it seems there's a connection between between people with Type 1 diabetes and shoulder problems, that said if you look into joint products like Ostio-Biflex you'll find they create problems with maintaining your glucose levels, so discontinue using it. Next, because of your age, you're a bit young to be experiencing circulatory problems from your condition. This said, it's more likely a result of some type of nerve damage coming from the shoulder problem.

When we talk about shoulders remember that the shoulder is the second largest joint in the human body, only exceeded by the hip joints. When shoulder damage takes place it can be in a number of different areas that can stem from different parts of the back, neck , shoulders or arm. This is because the network of nerves that run through the shoulder and armbone spacing is extensive. It's very difficult to pin point where the problem source is, compared to where we end up feeling pain coming from.

Most shoulder problems that were not created via major tears or impact separations will usually heal by themselves if given enough time. Shoulders heal very slowly due to the size of the joint and how often it's used. If we completely stop using a shoulder and it remains immobilized for any length of time, this is the worst thing possible, since it will develop scare tissue build-up and eventually freeze totally. Therefore they require as much movement as possible within their normal rotational range to remain free and joint lubricated.

What they do not need is to a have a heavy load put on them while in the early stages of an injury. Cartilage will usually heal given several weeks of light usage, so lay off it with the vertical bow unless you'd rather look forward to a surgery followed by 7 to 9 months of horrible Physical Therapy. At 31 years old your body can easily recover and bounce back as long as you don't continue to inflame the injury. The more inflamed the surrounding ligaments or tendons become, the more friction and damage you'll continue to do.

Try taking some light 5 pound dumbbell weights bend at the waist and swing your arms at full length first left and right in front of you and then forward and backward to exercise only the range of motion of the injured shoulder. 40 or 50 of these three times daily should create no pain and provide plenty of motion. In about two weeks if all is going well, you can move up to a ten pound weight for another couple of weeks.

If after a month of this you are still having the same amount of pain, it's time to see a good physical therapist. Surgey should be your last option only if everything else fails.

Last, mayayers had recommended above the use of a Hickory Creek In-Line Draw Lock. I would strongly agree and suggest you take a serious look at them. For under $200. these units will solve all the problems of being able to shoot your bow at its existing weight or greater and completely take all the pressure off being able to both draw it easily and hold it with absolutely no pressure on your shoulder.

I purchased one recently and just completed writing a technical product review of them in the "General Forum". My intent was to use it to increase my bow weight to eighty pounds while also increasing my accuracy while reducing my ease of drawing and holding at full draw. My Mathews MR7 now draws easier than a 40 lb. pull bow and I hold nothing at full draw, so I can stand there all day and shoot, but never get tired in any way.

He gave you great advice.

Regards,

Xbow755
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
xbow755 said:
Hi Krealitygroup,
Maybe I can shed some light on a couple of things that may help.
You're probably not aware of it, but it seems there's a connection between between people with Type 1 diabetes and shoulder problems, that said if you look into joint products like Ostio-Biflex you'll find they create problems with maintaining your glucose levels, so discontinue using it. Next, because of your age, you're a bit young to be experiencing circulatory problems from your condition. This said, it's more likely a result of some type of nerve damage coming from the shoulder problem.

When we talk about shoulders remember that the shoulder is the second largest joint in the human body, only exceeded by the hip joints. When shoulder damage takes place it can be in a number of different areas that can stem from different parts of the back, neck , shoulders or arm. This is because the network of nerves that run through the shoulder and armbone spacing is extensive. It's very difficult to pin point where the problem source is, compared to where we end up feeling pain coming from.

Most shoulder problems that were not created via major tears or impact separations will usually heal by themselves if given enough time. Shoulders heal very slowly due to the size of the joint and how often it's used. If we completely stop using a shoulder and it remains immobilized for any length of time, this is the worst thing possible, since it will develop scare tissue build-up and eventually freeze totally. Therefore they require as much movement as possible within their normal rotational range to remain free and joint lubricated.

What they do not need is to a have a heavy load put on them while in the early stages of an injury. Cartilage will usually heal given several weeks of light usage, so lay off it with the vertical bow unless you'd rather look forward to a surgery followed by 7 to 9 months of horrible Physical Therapy. At 31 years old your body can easily recover and bounce back as long as you don't continue to inflame the injury. The more inflamed the surrounding ligaments or tendons become, the more friction and damage you'll continue to do.

Try taking some light 5 pound dumbbell weights bend at the waist and swing your arms at full length first left and right in front of you and then forward and backward to exercise only the range of motion of the injured shoulder. 40 or 50 of these three times daily should create no pain and provide plenty of motion. In about two weeks if all is going well, you can move up to a ten pound weight for another couple of weeks.

If after a month of this you are still having the same amount of pain, it's time to see a good physical therapist. Surgey should be your last option only if everything else fails.

Last, mayayers had recommended above the use of a Hickory Creek In-Line Draw Lock. I would strongly agree and suggest you take a serious look at them. For under $200. these units will solve all the problems of being able to shoot your bow at its existing weight or greater and completely take all the pressure off being able to both draw it easily and hold it with absolutely no pressure on your shoulder.

I purchased one recently and just completed writing a technical product review of them in the "General Forum". My intent was to use it to increase my bow weight to eighty pounds while also increasing my accuracy while reducing my ease of drawing and holding at full draw. My Mathews MR7 now draws easier than a 40 lb. pull bow and I hold nothing at full draw, so I can stand there all day and shoot, but never get tired in any way.

He gave you great advice.

Regards,

Xbow755
Thanks so much! Man. I heard about people blowing their shoulders. This is no joke. Also, I didn't know about Osteo-Biflex and Diabetes. This is good education. I'm getting the Draw loc ASAP. The bummer is that this is only my second season. I worked so hard to actually learn how to shoot from nothing. Well such as life.. Keep it moving

Gabowman said:
Throughout my younger years I simply LOVED everything to do with a compound bow...hence the name GA bow man. I shot targets late summer getting ready for hunting season then hunted the entire season from mid Sept until Jan 1 with my bow. After deer season ended I shot 3-D tournaments and that carried me up into the warm part of spring/summer where I spent the rest of the off season shooting fish (daytime and nitetime shooting). I guess as I got older I worked longer hours behind a desk and computer and gradually got more and more out of shape. Now at 58 years old I find it uncomfortable, even painful, trying to pull back even 60#'s on my 80% letoff V-bow. I found it so much so that I had all but forgotten about bowhunting until I ran across this site. After quite a bit of reading and asking questions I ordered my 1st and only crossbow last year, the Excal, and have found the blood is still pumping red over hitting the woods with a bow again. This time it's with the horizontal bow though.
Man, this is exactly how I feel. I'm about to focus on the XBow with a crank.
 

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Myself, had a bicep muscle that tore off when lifting something heavy. My left arm was repaired,
but it never gained 100 pct strength that it had. I have no problem cocking a crossbow with the
cock rope if that doesn't do it for you, and you don't like the cocker mechanism that crossbows
have then you might like to look into the Parker Concorde Crossbow. It cocks and decocks all
by compressed air. You can get a couple of compressed air cyclinders that they use for the
paintball guns. Once you acquire a few cyclinders, you can have them refilled at Paintball gun
facilities. The Parker Concorde crossbow was made with the disabled individual in mind.
 

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73 yrs old, both shoulders cut, the right one badly messed up by HS football. Loved archery but eventually arthritis made pulling even a 40 lb vert too paimful to practice (in my 50s). Crossbows saved the day. Bought a 175 lb Parker and a mechanical cocker but found I didn't even need the mech cocker to pull the bow. Sting cocker is easy enough, no pain, if bow isn't too strong.. It's a different motion and not as far back as pulling a vert (power stroke only 14"). I shortened the cocker rope so I have to pull the second hook up to the string some 4-6", which made the pull even shorter. Now shoot 4 crossbows with ease but avoid the heavy pulls like 225 lb Equinox, Matrix 380, Mission 360 and other 'fast' bows.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I'm going to focus on XBow and rifle now. Right now I still have full movement, so why lose it.
I appreciate yall.
 

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ScorpyD ACLEUS 460
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Hi Guys,
I gotta tell you, I've been through two frozen shoulders (both right and left) and the 2 hours of surgery and repair that go along with each. The surgery was a cake walk compared to the more than 9 months of physical therapy 3x per week and home exercising every single day.

In each case I was released after the P/T ended and was told my shoulder was as strong as it was before the problem. In each case it took another 5 - 6 months before I could even draw a 50 lb. bow. Before the shoulders froze, I was competing in 3D competitions using a 74 lb. bow, so they were way off base with their comments.

Although I was able to return to shooting, I was never able to shoot with enough stamina in the shoulder to get above 70 lbs. again.

For those of you who have lost the ability to easily draw and hold a vertical bow at heavier weights, please take my word and check out the Hickory Creek Vertical In-Line Draw Lock. I guaranty you that it will be the best purchase you ever make.

Pulling and loading is both fast and simple. It takes so little effort that it's used extensively by handicapped people. The arrow speed that is achieved with this unit per pound of draw weight is equal to that achieved using a ScorpyD per pound of draw weight. Setup and sight in take only minutes to achieve tight groups at 60 - 80 yards.

I'm a TAC15i owner and shooter, so speed and accuracy mean everything to me. The draw lock on my Mathews Monster MR7 is my primary go-to choice when hunting. My PSE TAC 15 is my target choice.

Check one out for yourself and you'll change your mind about long range shooting capability!

Regards,

Xbow755
 
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