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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Virtually every new, cutting design crossbow has had its issues. Some are well publicized while others remain curiously out of the spotlight. A # of the flagship xbows have had extreme problems with string and serving life and stretching - getting way out of time, limbs breaking, crank cocker problems, inordinate delays in repair because of having to ship to the factory, etc..

In the big picture of things, the XP had comparatively few problems. It was wound too tight and had S&Cs that were too large in diameter, serving not tight enough and some sharp edge’s cams. This was NOTHING compared to many other xbows costing 2-3 times as much. The fixes were easy: slightly longer ATA, personally smoothing the cams and the new, factory threads which took care of everything. Actually, the new factory threads took care of all the problems.

The X1 had a lesser problem area to work through. Don identified major S&Cs changes that were needed. And they’ll be incorporated before the first production bow goes out. This long lead time , as unfortunate as it is, will help for a better rollout.

Though, I’ve been very slow at coming to this point, I’ve come to realize that these fully enclosed rails allow for a much more efficient arrow design: a higher foc and a lot less vane size and control. The virtual absence of archer’s paradox removes the need for standard sized vanes/orientations. The smaller vanes with a lot less drag cause the trajectory to be much flatter than a standard arrow would have at the same speed. Like 40‘/sec faster than it really is. This is A BIG DEAL! A 400’/sec shot out of the X1 will have the trajectory of a 440’/sec launch out of a standard xbow. Also, as can be seen in my 101 yard shooting video done in 20 mph winds and gusting above that, the high foc, very small vane/little offset arrows are affected by crosswinds much less than standard vaned arrows.

Currently I’m having a shootout between 1.85” AAE and Heat vanes on Spynal Tapps. After all the discussion of the Easton Protrusion (9mm) shafts, I’m waiting on a set to set up exactly like the Spynal Tapps for comparison.

This picture is of a KI factory arrow, a Heat vane and a 1.85” AAE Hybrid.

 

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Thanks for the info, Steve. I have had crossbow money attempting to burn a hole in my pocket for over a month now. Recently canceled my ordered bow. Still think the most prudent thing I can do is wait to be more sure. Some classified deals are making that difficult. As far as the tiny vanes, is that with field points? Have you or anyone tested with broadheads yet? Thanks.
 

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Thanks SEW for all your efforts. Again, it's this type of information sharing that makes this forum #1. I'm sure after the rollout and when I will have access to handle an X1, I'll have an increase in personal xbow inventory.
Thanks again!
 

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So Steve, Your indexing mark is on the cock not between hens. Do you feel an advantage doing it this way?

Also I am curios to your testing procedure...care to give us a paragraph on step by step?
 

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Cripes! I think my "toy" pistol crossbow has bigger vanes than the AAE Hybrids. That's crazy! Will be interesting to see how these fly with broadheads.

I know the later release will make for a better bow once it gets delivered to my door but man the waiting is painful!!
 

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If you are correct about the reduction in shaft oscillation then try a bare shaft or if you feel you need just a touch of drag do the following. Former member virtually never used vanes. This is one of his A/C/C shafts.
199792
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
So Steve, Your indexing mark is on the cock not between hens. Do you feel an advantage doing it this way?

Also I am curios to your testing procedure...care to give us a paragraph on step by step?
Randy,
Remember, on a SWAT series crossbow, the cock vane is “up”, not down. While I don’t think it makes any difference, in keeping with the indexing mark at the 12 o’clock position, I indexed where it would be there, the same as if it were between the hen vanes on a cock vane down situation.

In a separate post I’ll answer about my testing.
 

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I have always been a proponent of letting the bow determine the spine position.
I find it almost funny that everyone can justify that the spine should be "up" but when you shoot vertical bows, with the spine in the up position, the spine is in parallel with the bow limbs. On the other hand, when shooting crossbows, with the spine in the up position, the spine is at 90 degrees the the limbs and people use the same rational for both but the spine is in a completely different orientation.
 

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Thanks for the info, Steve. I have had crossbow money attempting to burn a hole in my pocket for over a month now. Recently canceled my ordered bow. Still think the most prudent thing I can do is wait to be more sure. Some classified deals are making that difficult. As far as the tiny vanes, is that with field points? Have you or anyone tested with broadheads yet? Thanks.
Really looking forward to the BH testing phase of this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I have always been a proponent of letting the bow determine the spine position.
I find it almost funny that everyone can justify that the spine should be "up" but when you shoot vertical bows, with the spine in the up position, the spine is in parallel with the bow limbs. On the other hand, when shooting crossbows, with the spine in the up position, the spine is at 90 degrees the the limbs and people use the same rational for both but the spine is in a completely different orientation.
You stated that it’s “funny” spine is placed up (on crossbows) but 90 degrees out on vertical bows, correct?

I’ll try to answer to the best of my knowledge - which isn’t complete for sure. On a traditional railed crossbow, the arrow can’t flex downward, or sideways but only somewhat upward as upward flexing is lessened by the arrow hold down spring or whatever. On the enclosed rail crossbows, with slightly less than a 24/64” diameter for a 22/64” diameter arrow leaves <1/64” flexing room in any direction. Actually, I’ve wondered if spine indexing or matching even matters with an enclosed rail.

Vertical bows have a lot more archer’s paradox than a railed crossbow. A traditional railed crossbow has a lot more archer’s paradox than an enclosed railed crossbow.
 

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My points exactly shoot a bare shaft to see were individual bow prefers them for best accuracy.
My Mathews vertical bow prefers them in to 10 o'clock to 4 o'clock plane. My Hickory Creek prefers them at the 2 o'clock to 7 o'clock plane. Both limbs are in the vertical orientation with the spine different for each. Lumping all spines in one direction for all bows means that each bow needs to be tuned to the arrow. By changing the tune of my bow I can make it prefer the spine differently, especially because both bows use a whisker biscuit, which acts like the barrel guiding and dampening arrow oscillation.
 

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have you tested different nocks? just curious which one seems to work best?
how do the strings seem to hold up?
 
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