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Hi CNers,

I have a Barnett Panzer and got it to shoot about 3" groups at 15yds. It has just a plastic fake scope site. Would a Red Dot help, and what in general is a realistic expection of accuracy for this bow. I shoot a vertical bow (Guardian) and 20yds/2" groupings, 30yds/3" groupings is reasonable for me. We won't be target shooting, just hunting turkey and deer at
 

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With one of my Darton bows, I put one arrow into the back of another at about 18+ yards.
Actually...I quit shooting more than one arrow per bull because of the above, also deeply scoring another and making it unusable...and hitting the corner of a nock and having to replace the nock.....

So....it's been one arrow per bulls eye for some time now.
At least with the two Darton bows and my Stryker.
I'm hoping the new Horton Recon is as good!

Mike
 

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Accuracy.

With my Desert Stryker at 20 yards I found I should not shoot at the bullseye with more than one arrow at a time.

at 25 yards the arrow fletchings are usually touching.

AT 35 yards a baseball would cover most arrows.

I have not been able to shoot beyond 35 yards due to limits of my back yard.

Have only had the D/S for several weeks and have shot maybe 75 arrows. Several fletchings replaced,four scrapped.
 

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I rarely shoot at less than 30 yards

when practicing. I shoot a lot at 40, 50 and 60 yards and sometimes I will shoot at 70 yards for extended periods. I NEVER shoot more than one arrow, go get it and shoot it again, even at 70 yards. IMHO practicing shooting multiple arrows before pulling them is detrimental to good practice AND arrows:p As to what can be expected in accuracy, the difference between my most accurate and least accurate crossbow is minimal and certainly non -consequential in hunting situations. I spent several months testing numerous crossbows in what I considered hunting situations. By this I mean sitting and resting by left elbow on my hip or thigh for all shots. I used red dot reflex sights on all the bows since that's all I use for hunting. All testing was done at 70 yards using the most accurate arrow and point weight combination I could find for each bow (actually this is what took the most time). As you see, there was very little practical accuracy difference from bow to bow. As a matter of fact, the bow I've found to be most accurate for me for 3D stand up off hand shooting is not the most accurate bow for sitting hunting shots where I can rest my left elbow on my hip or thigh. Here's the results. Keep in mind the numbers listed are not group size but the furthest away from the aiming point any of my arrows hit the target. I make no claims as to my test being anything but that.............my test:D


Buck Buster by Parker 3”
Least accurate crossbow tested – Possibly resulting from barrel track distortion


Desert Stryker by Bowtech 1 ”
Quietest crossbow tested and tied for second most accurate – virtually recoil-free


Phantom by Ten Point 1 ”
Tied for second most accurate crossbow tested – Not as quiet as the Desert Stryker and second heaviest physical weight tested


Pro Slider by Ten point 2.5”
Light weight – compact size – comfortable – One of my favorite hunting crossbows


Stealth X2 by Ten point 2 ’
Four years old and still a great shooter – on the heavy side


Stryker by Bowtech 1.5”
Fasted and heaviest crossbow tested - Possible reasons for it being the most accurate in my tests


Vortex by Excalibur 2 ”
The current standard in recurve crossbows – lighter than most all compound models


315 by Middleton 2.5”
Lightest physical weight crossbow tested – May be the reason I could not quite match the accuracy level of the Excal Vortex
 

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Sorry:)

Above photo is not the right one:ack2: The Parker and Middleton arre not shown. I sold the Parker and had to return the Middleton after testing.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Accuracy pointers: Do you always use the cocking crank?

It seems to make a difference if I use the crank to get the bow cocked. Is this everyone's experience: better results with the aid than without?

Thanks,

JK
 

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I would highly recommend

folks use a rope cocker even if they can manually cock their crossbow without it. There is quite a bit of difference normally between these cocking methods with most corssbows. There seems to be one exception and that's the Bowtech Desert Stryker with its large Binary cams that the manufacturer says actually center the string when fully cocked. As this is one of the most accurate crossbows I've ever shot, I'd say Bowtech's claim is legitimate.
 

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ED

Over the last several years I've setteld on Blazer 2" vanes for all crossbow shooting and hunting. I did this for durability and ease of fletching. My tests showed early on that I lost no accuracy as compared to 4 or 5 inch vanes when using field points, mechanical broadheads and Judo practice heads so Blazer vanes were used in all my accuracy tests.

Although some manufacturers recommend moon nocks to prevent dry fire situations, I've never had a dry fire with a flat nock from any crossbow and I shoot literally every day so I used nothing but aluminum flat nocks for all tests and for all shooting and hunting. It's interesting that I have experienced a couple dry fires as a result of loading an arrow with a moon nock that was indexed wrong:ack2: when I first started shooting crossbows.

So the above nocks and vanes were a constant in my tests,

I used 3 shafts for my tests, 2219 Easton 20" aluminum with aluminum screw-in inserts, Easton 20" and 22" Power Bolt shafts with aluminum screw-in inserts and Gold Tip 20" and 22" Lazer II's with heavy brass 110 grain screw-in inserts. It's interesting that no crossbow I tested shot Gold Tips with the light weight aluminum screw-in inserts more accurately than with the brass inserts so the light weight aluminum inserts were not used.

After much experimenting with point weights on the above shafts I settled on 100 and 175 grain points. One of these points was used in all accuracy testing.

I shot a minimum of 50 arrows for the actual accuracy testing and I'm sure there were some human factors involved in the results but I tried to keep that to a minimum by being well rested when testing with minimum windy conditions.

I made not real effort to try to determine why a given crossbow "liked" a certain arrow shaft type, weight or point weight. Some of the crossbows were extremely accurate with the heavier Easton Power Bolt shaft with 170 grain points and some of the crossbows shot the lighter weight Gold Tip shafts with 100 grain points just as accurately. I found that the more flexible 2219 aluminum shafts did well in 2 of the slower compound crossbows but the faster crossbows liked the much stiffer carbon shafts. The 22" arrows were used only for the Stryker and Desert Stryker crossbows. It's interesting that they did not shoot the most accurately for me with the same arrow. The Desert Stryker is deadly accurate with the GT 22" with 100 grain point but the Stryker was most accurate for me with the 504 grain 22" Power Bolt shaft with 170 grain point. The Phantom was most accurate with a 20" Easton Power Bolt shaft with 170 grain point. This bow is set up and ready for deer hunting with this combination.
 

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Yep...a rope cocking aid.
Only way to keep the string from shifting (some sort of cocking aid!) to one side and having it toss the back of the arrow off center.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks--keep it coming!

Folks,

This is just great stuff. Thank you very much for your support. Two nights ago I used the crank and had the best results yet. At least it stopped me from sending the thing back yet...I will order a Red Dot sight and work with that.

Moonkryket,
Were you grouping numbers from 20yds? Thanks for the detail and hard work. I am archieving this thread....

JK
 

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I'm different than what is "reccomended" LMAO. I set my bows up to shoot 25 yards. If I shoot something closer, there isn't much arc to the arrow so I can shoot fairly straight without having to lower my sight area. But, when I sight them in, I then shoot and zero in at 35, then 45, etc. Fine tune the bow. That way, if I see a bobcat or coyote at 55 yards, I know my arrow is in the zone. The only way I'm off is my error, by not being steady enough.
I saw where someone said use the same arrow. That can be very true. Occasionally, I get an arrow that doesn't fly like the others.
That's why it is always good to shoot while practicing, what you hunt with. I have also found the Aluminum arrows are more accurate than the Carbon arrows.
I don't use a cocking device. I just feel the rail as I cock the bow and keep the bowstring cocked even and not to one side or the other because that can cause you to shoot irratic if it's to one side. Some people mark the string on each side with whiteout before they cock, so they can see if they cock crooked or not.
When sighting in, always use a rest, just like you would sight in a rifle. Less room for error.
 

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John

My test numbers do not represent group size. They represent the distance in inches the furthest away from target center any arrow hit the target, in other words, group size will be double that number. All my testing was done at 70 yards.
 

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John,

to answer your question: a buddy of mine from Berkley Springs,WV ruined 18-20 arrows shooting groups at a target at @25M, as he kept splitting them with his Exocet! (it took him that many arrows to figure out that he was accidentally "doing the Robin Hood thing", as he IS a West "by God" Virginian!!!)

folks from other states take less arrows to learn that, unless of course they are former students of Tx A&M !!! = CHUCKLE!

yours, texasnative46:):):)
 

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texas

I think you might just have ticked off a few folks here:ack2:

One of the reasons continually thrown at us crossbow shoooters and hunters by anti-crossbow folks is that crossbows are too accruate to be allowed in bowhunting season:eek:
 

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moonkrykat,

perhaps so, but i "call 'em as i see 'um".

tell me, WHY the ability to take a piece of game humanely is considered a BAD thing by the "radical fringe" of "vertical archers" (i used to BE a vertical archer, btw & i STROVE for accuracy/consistency EVERY time i drew a bow.).

fwiw, NONE of my "vertical archery" friends look down on CB hunters;they consider us "part of the family".

we all know that the "PETA crowd" just wants NOBODY to hunt by ANY means and/or OWN/USE any sort of weapon whatever (most of the PETA fools are also anti-Second Amendment EXTREMISTS, too.), so i couldn't care less if those twits are offended/ticked off. i don't care if they "go away mad";i just want them to "GO AWAY".

yours sincerely,texasnative46
 

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Laughing. Yes, if you haven't found the elitist attitude from vertical bow hunters, you haven't met many or any from the Bow hunters associations.
I think their private bible says Anti Crossbow somewhere. The same as it said Anti Compound before the 1970's. Notice how that turned out?
I read one of the reasons for NOT allowing xbows in archery season is due to "too accurate." It seems they try and find ANY excuse to not "share their season". Which is another problem-they see archery season as "theirs" exclusively. I believe they are actually the biggest Anti hunter group we face when trying to get xbows allowed in archery season, and in some states, just legal in general season. If you read the bi-laws of the various associations, it says "promote archery hunting" not promote hunting.
That is just one of many, and it does sound so stupid, doesn't it? Too accurate. Isn't that what is necessary and desired? Accuracy with any tool comes from practice and experience. With that presented excuse, it makes me think that the Wildlife Dept.s did well putting archery season first so the rifle, muzzleloader, handgun, and xbow hunters can clean up the mess they made wounding game, if that statement were true. Believe me, as a guide, Ive seen some really poor shots pulled from Vertical and xbow shooters, as well as rifle shooters. Experience and practice makes us good at what we do, with whatever weapon we choose. Bottom line. Too accurate. I'm still laughing!
 

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guidegirl/all,

well, i guess i'm just LUCKY in having "a better class of friends" (CHUCKLE!).

many of my friends in both TX & in northern/suburban VA (where i have an apartment & access to a over 6-months long "urban deer season"!!!) accept me as a "now crippled up" (osteo got my right shoulder/elbow & forearm- falling off a 18' ladder onto a tile floor didn't help! = OUCH!!!), but still "a member in goodstanding" of the "archery club".

further, as VA now allows CBs (with NO discrimination against them for ALL hunters & the CB hunters numbers are growing FAST!), i think NOBODY/almost NOBODY in VA is "involved" in this fight, such as it may be elsewhere.====> i'm GLAD of that!!!

to any "vertical archers", who may be lurking, may i simply say: THE ENEMY is the LEFTIST/HATE-FILLED/ arrogant/ignorant PETA NUTS & their allies in the anti-gun crowd, so lay-off the "in house" criticism & help defeat THE ENEMY of us all.

the TRUTH is that THE FRUITS & NUTS want everyone (many want the disrmament to include the POLICE, if you can believe that!) disarmed, "peaceful" & DEFENSELESS. many of the NUTS also SAY that they don't believe in the RIGHT of self-defense, even when actually ATTACKED!!

may i also remind you all that the fascists disarmed everybody except the "elites", as a major step toward tyranny/TERROR in 1930s Germany, Romania, Austria,Japan, Spain & Italy? ====> the "opposition" is NOT "the good guys".

yours, texasnative46:):):)
 

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Texas

Tell us how you really feel:D

I remember back in 1971 when the compounds were looked upon as evil and was predicted to put an end to archery and bowhunting:p Now it's crossbows' turn to take the flak. I think things are going in the right direction and at a pace that is even better than I expected:)
 
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