[bunnyrabbit]

In regards to the limb failure of either splintering or breaking, the limb manufacture
failed in one or more of the following: 1)improper ingredient mixture, 2)improper
curing or 3)removing from the mold too soon.

These limbs that have or are failing can be found on the early KI crossbows, the
no longer manufactured Carbon Express 390 Pile Driver, the Bruin Ambush 370
and several series of the rebranded Rocky Mountain crossbows and the mentioned
Center Point Sinister 430. Feredyne Outdoors is the importer for Rocky Mountain
and checking their website, some replacement limbs are no longer available, nor
are some of those crossbows.
These poor quality limbs could possibly be manufactured at the same plant?
These crossbows are all manufactured overseas and depending for which importer
company may be labelled under a different name.

I shoot the following Center Point: XT390 Sniper, Patriot 415 and Heat 415. Target
shooting with many hundreds and thousands of shots on each with pin point accuracy.

A couple things I have found on these: 1)the spacer block that fits between the
riser and the rail stock is poor quality but can be strengthened. 2)who ever assembled
the Heat 415 and Patriot 415 either installed the wrong cams or the wrong length cables.
This resulted in much lower speeds taking into consideration if a heavier arrow point
combination was used. One can refer to posts on this forum in the 2020-2021 era.

Checking Center Point and 60X Custom Strings website, they use the same length cables.

Testing and modifying, my quickest fix was installing cables one inch shorter. Shooting
430 grain arrow-point combinations, my speed went from 333 to 389 and lower 390 feet
per second with the Pro Digital chronograph placed one arrow length in front of the riser.

Wishing you all the best.
Take care.

 

[cmarti1961]

I have been lurking here forever, and have learned so much. I appreciate TX_RDX and Bunny rabbit for info on the imports. The limb failures sure complicate buying decisions. I have had good luck with Centerpoint non ManKung crossbows. I have a Tormentor and got my grandson a Volt, that have hundreds of shots on them over several years. These are the two end cap screws in the end of the rail style (not a single riser bolt) that seem to have common failures in other brands. I can't determine the make between Poe Lang and Horizone, but parts are interchangeable across the retail "Brand" Am I lucky, or does CP have better QC in place with the manufacturers?


Based on my experience with CP, their customer service and a ton of research on parts and measurements.. I rolled the dice and just put a Dagger405 front end assembly Xpedition Viking 380 stock. My son bought My Granddaughter the Xpedition for christmas and did not register the bow. She is moving up from her fever recurve. When we got around to shooting it a limb began to splinter 10 shots in. So I “traded” her an old Horton Explored for her useless stock. I added a Killer Instinct stirrup and call this creation the Viking Lethal Dagger. The CP prod slipped right on. The Assemblies look identical. The cables are within 1/16 between the Dagger Tormentor and Viking. The Axle to axle made equal was a 1/4 inch not the half inch stated by Stated value. Dagger is supposed to have a 3/4 longer powerstroke than the Viking and Tormentor. We have put 40 shots through this assembly using silicone oil as string lube and 450 grain arrows. So Far So Good…


If it fails all I am out is $150 front end. My Granddaughter put a nice sponge camo paint job on it. I am outfitting 5 grand kids so I look for value. But limb failure will negate low price.It is easier with compound bows as I am able to pick up used Diamond Atomic or infinite edge adjustable bows. Low poundage bows don’t fail. Crossbows have been a tougher. I wish they still made the 150LB solid limb $250 Hortons.

 

[JYates85]

I have been lurking here forever, and have learned so much. I appreciate TX_RDX and Bunny rabbit for info on the imports. The limb failures sure complicate buying decisions. I have had good luck with Centerpoint non ManKung crossbows. I have a Tormentor and got my grandson a Volt, that have hundreds of shots on them over several years. These are the two end cap screws in the end of the rail style (not a single riser bolt) that seem to have common failures in other brands. I can't determine the make between Poe Lang and Horizone, but parts are interchangeable across the retail "Brand" Am I lucky, or does CP have better QC in place with the manufacturers?


Based on my experience with CP, their customer service and a ton of research on parts and measurements.. I rolled the dice and just put a Dagger405 front end assembly Xpedition Viking 380 stock. My son bought My Granddaughter the Xpedition for christmas and did not register the bow. She is moving up from her fever recurve. When we got around to shooting it a limb began to splinter 10 shots in. So I “traded” her an old Horton Explored for her useless stock. I added a Killer Instinct stirrup and call this creation the Viking Lethal Dagger. The CP prod slipped right on. The Assemblies look identical. The cables are within 1/16 between the Dagger Tormentor and Viking. The Axle to axle made equal was a 1/4 inch not the half inch stated by Stated value. Dagger is supposed to have a 3/4 longer powerstroke than the Viking and Tormentor. We have put 40 shots through this assembly using silicone oil as string lube and 450 grain arrows. So Far So Good…


If it fails all I am out is $150 front end. My Granddaughter put a nice sponge camo paint job on it. I am outfitting 5 grand kids so I look for value. But limb failure will negate low price.It is easier with compound bows as I am able to pick up used Diamond Atomic or infinite edge adjustable bows. Low poundage bows don’t fail. Crossbows have been a tougher. I wish they still made the 150LB solid limb $250 Hortons.
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Welcome to the Nation. Centerpoint ManKung do seem to be pretty reliable. I actually have a Killer Instinct Rapid 420 myself that is identical to the Amped and Patriot models. Killer Instinct also use Hori Zone for their bows besides ManKung. I have never heard of many positives with Poelang products. Have you ran your Dagger creation through a chronograph? Looks pretty cool

 

[Iron Duke]

I have been lurking here forever, and have learned so much. I appreciate TX_RDX and Bunny rabbit for info on the imports. The limb failures sure complicate buying decisions. I have had good luck with Centerpoint non ManKung crossbows. I have a Tormentor and got my grandson a Volt, that have hundreds of shots on them over several years. These are the two end cap screws in the end of the rail style (not a single riser bolt) that seem to have common failures in other brands. I can't determine the make between Poe Lang and Horizone, but parts are interchangeable across the retail "Brand" Am I lucky, or does CP have better QC in place with the manufacturers?


Based on my experience with CP, their customer service and a ton of research on parts and measurements.. I rolled the dice and just put a Dagger405 front end assembly Xpedition Viking 380 stock. My son bought My Granddaughter the Xpedition for christmas and did not register the bow. She is moving up from her fever recurve. When we got around to shooting it a limb began to splinter 10 shots in. So I “traded” her an old Horton Explored for her useless stock. I added a Killer Instinct stirrup and call this creation the Viking Lethal Dagger. The CP prod slipped right on. The Assemblies look identical. The cables are within 1/16 between the Dagger Tormentor and Viking. The Axle to axle made equal was a 1/4 inch not the half inch stated by Stated value. Dagger is supposed to have a 3/4 longer powerstroke than the Viking and Tormentor. We have put 40 shots through this assembly using silicone oil as string lube and 450 grain arrows. So Far So Good…


If it fails all I am out is $150 front end. My Granddaughter put a nice sponge camo paint job on it. I am outfitting 5 grand kids so I look for value. But limb failure will negate low price.It is easier with compound bows as I am able to pick up used Diamond Atomic or infinite edge adjustable bows. Low poundage bows don’t fail. Crossbows have been a tougher. I wish they still made the 150LB solid limb $250 Hortons.
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[rt2bowhunter]

IMO most of the time people look under the wrong rock to find the fix for limb problems.
Where are the limbs under the most stressed for the longest time when there bent right. To use a example of this let's use the old Excalibur. What bow is going to be the most trouble free a Matrix 330 or a 405. They use the same limbs the only difference the rail is longer thus the limbs are bent farther. I'd be willing to bet if you made a longer and longer rail you would get to the point the limbs would break without a shot fired on the reverse if you made the rail shorter and shorter bending the limbs less it's doubtful they would ever fail. The old excaliburs would survive a dryfire several of them .

So detuning the bow has got to help if that detune results in the limbs not bending as far and working as hard.

Arrow weight well sure a heavier arrow is easier on your limbs. Close a door slowly vs slamming it as hard as you can everytime. Ever get mad when someone slams your truck door to hard . I have never had set of limbs break while slowly letting the limbs down (uncocking).

The less you demand of something and the easier you are on it the longer it will last. This works on hammers also .

 

[JOE PA]

IMO most of the time people look under the wrong rock to find the fix for limb problems.
Where are the limbs under the most stressed for the longest time when there bent right. To use a example of this let's use the old Excalibur. What bow is going to be the most trouble free a Matrix 330 or a 405. They use the same limbs the only difference the rail is longer thus the limbs are bent farther. I'd be willing to bet if you made a longer and longer rail you would get to the point the limbs would break without a shot fired on the reverse if you made the rail shorter and shorter bending the limbs less it's doubtful they would ever fail. The old excaliburs would survive a dryfire several of them .

So detuning the bow has got to help if that detune results in the limbs not bending as far and working as hard.

Arrow weight well sure a heavier arrow is easier on your limbs. Close a door slowly vs slamming it as hard as you can everytime. Ever get mad when someone slams your truck door to hard . I have never had set of limbs break while slowly letting the limbs down (uncocking).

The less you demand of something and the easier you are on it the longer it will last. This works on hammers also .

I certainly get your point Joe, and agree about your example. With compound crossbows, I think it’s more about cocked ATA and string material (vectran or no). The cams should be designed for the power stroke (draw length). Too short cocked ATAhas the limbs overstrained for hours on a hunting bow.

 

[rt2bowhunter]

I have 2 compounds as everyone knows LOL. I have ran them detuned (backed the limb bolts out) reducing the poundage. Other than my new bow strings 8125E( i know nothing about) they used 452X string material known for low to no stretch. Just because of the arrows makeup i have always shot a 450gr plus arrow. I would hate to guess how many shots these 2 bows have seen over barking at if not 10 years... plus time spent cocked hours and hours. I will add they were never shot just to uncock i always let them down.

I'll use the Mission 320 vs the Mission 400 both i had/have and used.

I run the 320 at its max shooting a 401gr arrow. It shot 333 fps with a 452X string and cables.

The 400's also using a 452X string and cables would shoot the same arrow 413 fp max poundage.

Now i change nothing except i reduce the poundage (detune) of the 400 until it matches the speed of the 320. What bow would you expect to last the longest? .

 

[thomaskelley]

I’m sorry that happened to your bow and I’m glad you didn’t get hurt.

 

[Huntersthompson]

Like several of the KI models, I think they just tried to get more out of the xbow than the components could handle. After backing the limbs off a little they seem to have happy owners. Maybe this was just a one off but detuning some would be something to consider.

 

[Freepistol]

Glad you are OK!

 

[Iron Duke]

Glad you are OK!

 

[cmarti1961]

Welcome to the Nation. Centerpoint ManKung do seem to be pretty reliable. I actually have a Killer Instinct Rapid 420 myself that is identical to the Amped and Patriot models. Killer Instinct also use Hori Zone for their bows besides ManKung. I have never heard of many positives with Poelang products. Have you ran your Dagger creation through a chronograph? Looks pretty cool

No chrono 'till I get to my shop. Not a move for speed, just trying to salvage something and experimenting. Just surprised by the amount of parts you can share from the Taiwan parts bin. Trying to get a handle on who makes/sources what, and of what quality. It might be like anything else, you get what you pay for. I am hoping CenterPoint sources bang for the buck bows.

I have spent money on vertical compounds and maybe should not cheap out on crossbows for the grandkids. I got the Cabelas /Bass Pro master hunting catalog this week and the crossbow prices took my breath away. I don't know if I love those 6-12 year old kids enough to outfit them. I am trying to adjust. I killed a ton of deer with a $350 Horton Hunter, so 4 figure crossbows are another new reality I will need time to accept. On the other hand a $250 crossbow in a box at the sore, may not be a deal.🤷‍♂️

 

[GregoryAK4]

The saga continues. After getting it de-cocked I found that the rail had a deep gouge & the finger guard was also broken. Sent pics to CP then called. At first they wanted to warranty the parts & have my dealer change them. Once they found out they had no part numbers for them they called me back & said they’d be sending out a complete new back half, so I’ll have a brand new bow & lots of parts left over from the original.
They’re taking good care of me

Greg

 

[mhuntlane]

You could not give me a CP.2